Institute of Public Administration Australia (ACT) Limited

In this special International Men’s Day episode, Work with Purpose host David Pembroke, Founder and CEO of contentgroup, brings together two senior public sector leaders to explore what male role modelling looks like in practice − not in theory.

Deputy Secretary David Mackay (Regions, Cities and Territories, Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communications, Sport and the Arts) and Michael Pohl (National Manager for Smart Centres across Regional NSW and the ACT at Services Australia) share candid reflections on leadership, identity, caregiving, cultural background, and the real pressures of balancing demanding roles with busy family lives.

They discuss how men can foster psychological safety, model empathy, challenge outdated norms, support gender equity, and create environments where people feel seen, heard and valued. From early-career turning points to shifts in public policy, taking parental leave, and learning to lead with curiosity, humility and care, this episode offers a grounded look at what inclusive leadership really requires.

Listeners will hear lived experience, practical behaviours, First Nations perspectives, and personal stories that illuminate the difference male leaders can make in shaping respectful, healthy public sector workplaces.

Key Takeaways:

1. People remember how leaders make them feel: small moments of validation or dismissal shape workplace culture more powerfully than formal feedback.

2. Lead with questions, not answers: curiosity and humility help unlock team insight, build trust, and create stronger decisions.

3. Normalise shared caregiving: taking parental leave and protecting family time strengthens leaders and helps shift outdated gender norms.

4. Be honest about the chaos: vulnerability creates psychological safety and helps teams feel understood and supported.

Show Notes: 

David MacKay’s Choir | Coro Canberra 
Michael’s charity ride | Hartley Cycle Challenge